Real Talk with Tina and Ann
Tina and Ann met as journalists covering a capital murder trial, 15 years ago. Tina has been a tv and radio personality and has three children. Ann has a master's in counseling and has worked in the jail system, was a director of a battered woman's shelter/rape crisis center, worked as an assistant director at a school for children with autism, worked with abused kids and is currently raising her three children who have autism. She also is autistic and was told would not graduate high school, but as you can see, she has accomplished so much more. The duo share their stories of overcoming and interview people who are making it, despite what has happened. This is more than just two moms sharing their lives. This is two women who have overcome some of life's hardest obstacles. Join us every Wednesday as we go through life's journey together. There is purpose in the pain and hope in the journey.
Real Talk with Tina and Ann
Hot Flashes, Cold Takes, And Why Trucker Hats Are Ageless: Aging OutLOUD with Angela Burk
Midlife isn’t a slow fade; it’s a volume knob. We sit down with Angela, the force behind Real Girls Guide and RGG55, to rewrite the script on aging and claim midlife as a comeback. From the lost folder that sparked her book to the candid truths she shares about hormones, identity, and self-trust, this conversation is a bright, unflinching look at how women can live on purpose and take up space.
We dig into radical self-possession, the everyday practice of saying “no” without an essay, trusting your own voice without apology.
Because at some point, you realize it’s not about being invited anymore, it’s about creating spaces that feel like home.
So, you build your own table. You fill it with people who get it. the ones who bring wisdom, laughter, truth, and light.
The ones who see you, not just your highlight reel.
And you start, even before you have a roadmap, because sometimes the most beautiful journeys begin before you know the way. Angela brings data and lived experience to the hormone conversation, connecting estrogen changes to mood, libido, and confidence, and showing how education powers better care and louder advocacy. We talk hot flashes and humor, because laughter disarms shame and opens doors. We trace the cultural shift making this moment possible: women 40, 50, 60+ with spending power, visibility, and the will to speak plainly about bodies, sex, ambition, and reinvention.
You’ll hear how identity pivots from “Who do I have to be?” to “Who do I want to be now?” We explore friendships that trade comparison for courage, boundaries that need no apology, and the grit it takes to begin again. Angela’s upcoming book—built from 120 women and 25 experts—acts as a companion, not a blueprint, reminding us we’re not alone and there’s always a path forward. If you’ve ever felt dismissed, “past your prime,” or stuck on the edge of a new chapter, consider this your nudge to start.
Join us, subscribe, and share this conversation with someone who needs a push to live louder. If it resonated, leave a review and tell us: what boundary will you defend this week?
Welcome to Real Talk with Tina and Anne. I am Anne, and today we're diving into something that hits pretty close to home for me, and honestly, for a lot of women in midlife. The moment that I heard about you, Angela, I knew that I just had to have you on the show. This stage of life, it's full of pivots. It's about claiming or reclaiming who we are and who we want to be. I really see it as an exciting chapter. It's not a crisis chapter, it's not the end chapter, it's a comeback chapter. And you, Angela, are leading a full-blown midlife revolution, which I love. You're the writer and founder of Real Girls Guide and RGG 55 on Substack, and you're changing the narrative for women in their 40s, 50s, and beyond. We're going to talk all the good stuff. I mean all of it. Hormones, humor, identity, and why growing older doesn't mean fading out. It means turning up the volume. So let's age out loud. Angela, I am so glad to have you on the show.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I am so very glad to be here, Anne, and really thrilled that you invited me. So thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_07:We just had National Healthy Aging Month, and the this is Menopause Awareness Month. This is the perfect time to talk about this. Angela, we all age. I mean, it's inevitable. We can't not do it. So, what made now the right time to launch Real Girls Guide in RG55? What inspired you to do this?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it's it's a really good question. And um, the truth is that I actually had the idea for a book um when I was 35. So two decades ago, and the book was going to be The Real Girls Guide to Over 35. And I had built um chapter outlines and I had notes and I had a lot of these big questions that I felt I was facing at that time. I was newly married, I had a couple kids then. I was sort of at this pivot point in my one of many, but at a pivot point in my career. And and I didn't know it then, but even my body was changing. Um, the appearance of my body was changing, the function of my body was changing. I was starting to enter again. Back then I didn't have a word for it, but I was starting to enter perimenopause and I just had all these questions. And so I started a folder and I thought, I, you know what? I'm gonna write this book. I I've got questions. Other women, I'm sure, have stories and examples of ways that they've navigated through this. And I think it's what I need right now. And uh life got busy, and the folder literally got buried, um, buried under a lot of things, kind of literally literally and figuratively. And if I fast forward, I had the good fortune of retiring in December and I was cleaning up my desk and I found a folder. I found a folder.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, it was just the perfect time.
SPEAKER_02:It was the perfect time, and I opened the folder and I was like, you know, there were so many things that were happening to me. So, you know, like I had my own journey with menopause. It I kind of fully entered, I guess, that, you know, let's not have a period for 12-month phase and all of a sudden you're in menopause. That happened to me at the end of my 47th year. Yet there were still things that were changing for me. They were, you know, I was changing as a woman. Um, my marital status changed. I met a new man. I was kind of rediscovering myself on a lot of different vectors. But again, I didn't really have a label for what was happening. I just knew things were happening. So finding the folder and opening it, I was like, man, questions are different, but the themes were almost exactly the same. And I was like, you know what? I need to do this now. And so that's what I did.
SPEAKER_07:That's amazing. Right on time. And I say that all the time. It was just supposed to happen right now. It's really exciting that you're doing that right now. I think that women in general are changing. Do you think that women our age feel less than? Where does that message come from and how do we unlearn it?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it's a really good question. Um, you know, I think that the message comes from from a lot of different sources, right? You know, for me, I grew up um with very strong, strong women around me, but there were certain roles that these women played. Um, so I sort of had kind of the role models in my life um that I watched. I think the media has a lot to do with it too, right? Um, I love Diane Keaton, who, my goodness, like God bless her, and you know, really um such a sad passing for me. But you know, the media traditionally has not necessarily uh portrayed women of our age in a particularly exciting and powerful way. Um and then I think I love a lot of the stories um that I probably developed when I was a kid, you know, my role to not cause waves, um, to to be peaceful, yes, to not cause grief, to just to shrink and to play small, all for the sake of keeping everything calm around me. I personally let a lot of those things impact how I saw myself, how I saw myself in in my role in a lot of different facets of my life. And it wasn't like this, you know, this depressed state, I wouldn't say, but it just became ingrained. And I finally started realizing, you know, kind of as I entered 50 and in my early 50s, it was like, you know what? I'm done. I'm tired. I am out of F's. I don't know if we we curse here, but I'm a cursor. So I'm out of Fs to give, and I'm tired. And so my voice got louder. My voice got louder first with myself. You know, I don't have to um shrink, I don't have to play small, I don't have to say say no with an essay. I don't need to to allow the stories that other people wrote about me to be the ones I tell about myself. I just was a light bulb.
SPEAKER_07:I say this all the time. Oh my gosh, you just defined our podcast. Well, I think that we were raised in the time when it was sit up straight, tuck your shirt in, you have to look nice. Appearance is more important than anything else. Um, not really what's happening in real life, it's about appearance. And you have to um listen and be a peacemaker. And that's how I was trained. I think that a lot of our generation was trained that way, and allowing other people to define us. That was who we were. Yes, and and the same thing happened for me, where I got to the point where I was like, no more, no more. I'm gonna speak up and I'm gonna have a voice, and I'm gonna define who I am.
SPEAKER_02:Well, and I'm gonna define who I am, and I'm gonna do it with zero apologies. I don't owe the world comfort, I don't owe the world peace, I don't owe the world their joy. I I I just don't. I have to do this stuff for myself. And I I think what was so interesting about the book I idea I had 20 years ago and the book that I've I've written now is the fact that it's it's not a guide, although I I do like the the word guide. It's really not meant to be like, you know, the blueprint, right? But it is a companion, it is a start to how do we reframe this time? And it and it kind of starts with us, right? And I I found that that to be true for myself. It didn't start with anybody else sitting me down and going, hey, you know, you're at this point. I think you should kind of make some changes. I just got to a place and it was like this slow burn. It wasn't this big ignited fire. It was a slow burn of me just looking and stopping and going, wait a minute, this thing is happening to me. Why? Do I like it? Do I not? If I don't, I'm not gonna stand for it. This this opportunity is presenting itself to me. Why am I not taking it? Am I afraid? What's the worst that can happen? You know, and and it's it it kind of evolved into so many different facets of me as a person in the way I parented. I was going through these transitions where my kids, my two of my uh between my partner and I, we have a staggering number of children. We have seven. I have three boys myself, and they were trans, two of them are transitioning to adults. I was finding like I was the the my role as a parent was changing. And I'm like, look, I can let all these things happen to me, or I can take control. And I'm done letting other people define who I am, how I think, what I want, the things I'm gonna do, the things I'm not gonna do. That whole saying no without an essay, man, that's like life-changing for me. Life-changing.
SPEAKER_07:You know, I just love you. You are just speaking everything. Uh I can tell you that I know women who are in their 80s and 90s. One is 85, and she is running this agency for youth, and she is affecting so many kids every single day. And she never misses work and she exercises all the time. And I know a woman who's in her 90s, and she just wrote a book about and she's her life. She's writing a book about her life, and she's going around speaking. I happen to be at Hoda Cotpe's birthday party in New York City when I in it was an amazing birthday party. We had VIP tickets, we were front, you know, right up front and everything. And it was, it was, it was so good. And she came out of turning 60 saying, This is the best decade of my life. She left the Today Show and she's rewriting it. You know, I mean, these are all women who are living on purpose. And I love that saying, can you talk more about what it means to live on purpose?
SPEAKER_02:I love that. Um, and I frame it, um, it it's the very same sentiment, but I've called it this kind of radical midlife self-possession. And I think where it starts, right? When you live on purpose, you live with intention, right? And for me, for me, what that means is I don't just let things happen. I'm very inquisitive, I'm very directed. And if things are, if I'm noticing a shift, if I'm noticing an opportunity, if I'm seeing something that I want to do, I am very intentional. Like, what is happening? Why? And is this something I want to do? Is this something I want to experience? And if the answer to that is yes, then I'm gonna do it. And I think for me, this idea of living on purpose is living with intention. And it's yeah, you could feel the fear because I gotta tell you, I spent 30 years in high-tech marketing writing a book. Um I've never done it. Right, launching a Substack, I've never done it. And so for me, there's a lot of fear in that, but I'm feeling the fear and doing it anyway. And I think the this idea of this, you know, what I've called this radical midlife self-possession is for the first time in my life, and I'm seeing this through friends and women that I've had the opportunity to meet, we are starting to live for ourselves. We are starting to reclaim um and reframe the role that we have as individuals and what we want the next phase of our life to look like. And, you know, and so I think that that living on purpose, there's a lot of intention behind it, there's a lot of self-awareness, but there's also this radical embracing of hey, this phase is about me. And it's not to be um, you know, rude and it's not to be dismissive of of other people, but it is to put ourselves first. And this is a shift. I mean, for me, you know, when you're raised as uh a woman, you become a wife, you become a mom. Um, for those of us who've gone down that path, we're kind of intrinsically like shaped to just give to everybody. That's what you give, you give you, give. And then finally, at this, yeah, I think because I have so few things left to give, I'm finally looking at it and going, no, no, no. It starts here and it has to start here.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, normally we're the last people that we think of.
SPEAKER_02:Totally, totally.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So I do think that living on purpose is you know, the the acceptance of and the embrace of ourselves. It is this feeling, this vibe, uh, and intention of reclaiming um either parts of ourselves that maybe we ignored or kind of l let let get dusty. I know for me, that's how I felt for a lot of times. Like a lot of the things that I loved about myself and that I knew made me a great person, I kind of let go. I I I let I left them in the shadows and and I'm done doing that. Yeah, so that that's kind of my view. It's it's it's kind of being intentional, but also being a little bit self-possessive, and and that's not a bad thing.
SPEAKER_07:No, it's not. And you know, and that we have to give ourselves permission to do that. I mean, yes, I I am living my best life, and I am not slowing down at all. I'm actually doing things that I've always wanted to, and that's with adopting three young kids in my 50s. That's what I did. So I am homeschooling one of them right now, and he just brings me so much joy. I mean, I'm really happy doing this, and I'm also running this podcast and meeting people all over the country like you. And I am so blessed in so many ways, and I feel like I'm just getting started. How can women tap into their passions when they are older? How can they rebuild themselves after some people think they are washed up?
SPEAKER_02:I think a lot of it, and and again, I'm I'll kind of reframe it from my perspective, but a lot of the the how-tos, I think, come from talking to other women. I mean, honestly, that was one of the premises of this book, right? So 30 or 20 years ago when I was 35, I was really struggling because I was having all these feelings and none of my friends were talking about it. Um, you know, my mom and I are 19 years apart, and in some ways, I love it. My mom is one of my best friends right now, and I love it. But there were things that were happening to her when I was in my 30s that I just associated with that's old. She's old because she's my mom. But in reality, we were 19 years apart. But I think part of it for me was the struggle that nobody was talking about it. And so what I found that's happening now, which I think is so great, is that there are so many more voices talking. And I think it starts with, hey, you've got to tune into the the volume of act of noise around us because there's something to it. I am seeing more and more, I mean, you're this podcast, um, authors who are writing, women on Substack, um celebrities, right? Who are writing books and we're having these open conversations about the things that are happening to us. Um, we're talking about hormones, we're talking about menopause, we're talking about libido changes, we're just having these conversations. So I think part of it for me was, you know, the I couldn't ignore the noise. And then when I had this idea, so found the folder in December, in April, I was like, okay, I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna write a book. And so that's what I started doing. And as I started talking to more of my friends, what I found was that created a groundswell. And I think that where we for me, and that gave me almost it gave me validation a little bit, and it gave me this sense of, you know, spoiler alert, I everything that I was feeling, it wasn't just me. And I was like, you know what? There is something to this. And so I think it starts with, hey, what's happening in your circle? What's happening around you? Listen to that. Then it's what's happening for me? What am I feeling right now? Do I feel restless? Do I feel dissatisfied? Do I feel like I have something in me that I want to go do, a passion that I want to go try? Am I fearful about it? Okay, cool. But what's stopping me? And then, like, okay, let's work through the things that are stopping me. And then giving us permission to go, okay, it's okay to feel the fear, but do something. Just start. And for me, it was just start writing. And that's what I did. Like, I didn't know, I didn't know any, like, I've never written, you know, for my job, I've written, but I think that that's how we work through it. It's what's happening around us, talk to people, talk to people around us and people that we trust, and figure out what it is you want to do and just begin.
SPEAKER_07:I think that we lose ourselves in all these decades of giving and being all these other roles, that it's really difficult to figure out what we want. So it's even more than just giving ourselves permission. I mean, that's the start, of course. But then I think that talking and writing, I think that that is so important for us to be able to find ourselves.
SPEAKER_02:A hundred percent. And that's why the podcast that you and Tina run, the conversations that you have are so important. And I think as women, it's almost like in some ways, there's so much information, right? If you just take menopause, like so much information that's happening, and it's sometimes hard to read through it, but the fact that we're noticing, I'm noticing a dramatic increase of women talking, yeah, women talking to other women, women sharing their stories, getting vulnerable and really honest. And that's hard, right? Um, but it's happening around us. And when you find the ability to to kind of tap into that and then give yourself a minute to just go, what are the things I want right now?
SPEAKER_07:Yeah. I I would say that when we first do it did this podcast, and my generation, I'm older than Tina, but you know, I almost felt like with some of the things that I was saying, like I was like, Oh, did P did I say that out loud? Are people can people hear me? You know, I mean, I felt pretty bad for doing that, but then I'm like, no, no, speak it, say it, you know, say how you feel.
SPEAKER_02:It's so true. So there's two things I want to I want to comment on that because it's absolutely a yes and, you know, um, as I started writing, so I started writing the book in April, I launched my newsletter, The Real Girl's Guide to Over 55 on Substack in June, maybe the middle of June. And I write probably three times a week. And I do write a lot about topics that are sensitive. I write a lot about sex, um, libido. I write a lot about kind of discovering things about myself that to be totally honest, I didn't know until I was in my 40s and 50s. And somebody had asked me, a friend had asked me, aren't you embarrassed that your boys might read this stuff? And I'm like, you know what? I'm not, actually. Um, you know, there's there's a chapter in the book where I do write a lot about my um relationship now and some amazing experiences that have allowed me to tap into things that I didn't even know about myself. And through the chapter, I have three warnings to all seven of our children. Like, okay, kids, you know, warning, this is about to get real. You might want to put the book down, middle of the chapter. Like, are you still here? And then the end of the chapter. It's like, if you're here, like Godspeed to you. But um, so I I'm not embarrassed, actually. And then the second um example that this uh just brings to my mind is through the writing of the book, I had a great um the great pleasure of meeting a woman who um is an 82-year-old author, and she was incredible. So she and I did an interview for the book. I ended up doing a blog QA with her, and she um actually wrote her first book when she was in her late 70s, early 80s about grief. She had lost her husband and she was struggling. And she then went on to find love at 82. So the last question I asked her was something like, you know, um, what's been the most surprising thing about finding love at this stage? And she said that the parts still work and I like it. And I was like, here's this 82-year-old, amazing woman, and and this is what we're talking about.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, I think that when my mom and her friends, you know, she's my my mom's been gone since 2008, but she had a group of women that all tell you what, they were spitfires, and they would bowl and they called themselves the happy hookers, and and they, you know, they would look at the guys bowling and things like that. And I even said something to one of the women that my mom would hang out with, and she'd say, 'I'm not dead,' you know, and I'm just like, 'Yes,' I mean, I loved it. That's what it's all about.
SPEAKER_02:It really is, and that's reminding me of a story. So I was really close to both of my grandmothers, but my maternal grandmother in particular. And I remember being in my 20s, and I, you know, I didn't have an active like social life in my 20s. I was, you know, I went to school, I started working. So I spent a lot of Friday nights with my grandma, and we would watch things like Murder She Wrote for those who uh remember those shows. But one night I was helping my grandma put laundry away and I went into a drawer and I saw a leopard, kind of leopard print of something, and I pulled it out and I held it out in front of my arms, and I accusingly looked at her and I said, What are these? And she said, Well, we may be old. She was referring to my grandpa, but we're not dead. And she said, And remember, love is where you find it, like in the kitchen, on the dining room table, in the bathroom, in the living room. And I was like, Well, that's just says it all. Like, you know, and she was in her, gosh, she was in her 70s at that point.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So, you know, they these conversations happen, but I think, I think they're happening more now. And I I could not be happier, could not be happier. That finally, finally, we're having these conversations.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah. I mean, I think that they kind of started to pave the way for us. You know, I mean, I can remember my aunts, and they were the next generation up above my mom. And I mean, the dresses and the hair was up, and they cooked in their dresses, and you always had to come to the table. And but I was surrounded by strong women. And I think that that really helped me. Their strength showed up in the home, I think that more outside as change makers in the world. But now women are redefining what's possible at every single age. How do you think that we got here? What shifted in our culture and in ourselves to open that door?
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think, okay, so I have a few points of view, but you know, just from a data perspective, I was reading a statistic that said something like by the year 2030, women over 55 will represent like nearly one-third of the US female population. Okay. So there's something that's happening just in our numbers. I also think that what's happening is a lot of um, a lot of our economic system is tapping into the fact that we women uh above the age of 40 have a lot of spending power. So all of a sudden, we are becoming a very attractive and irrelevant demographic. So that's number one. Um, and and so you can look at that and go, gosh, you know, is that really what it takes? Like everything's about dollars and cents. But you know, we can we can debate that for sure. But let's just like the data doesn't lie. Um, so so there's that. And I so I think that part of it is there are more of us, right? In this, in this midlife, and you know, even again, midlife is a little bit of an arbitrary phrase, but you know, when you look at our demographic, um, late 40s, 50s, 60s, and beyond beyond, there's just a lot of us. We have a lot of power. And I think we're starting to see more of us in positions that are very visible, personally. And I think so. That's one thing. I also wonder if part of this is, you know, the fact that in the course of you know, this influencer culture, right? You see a lot more women just getting very vocal and comfortable sharing parts of their lives. So I can't say that because before June, when I launched my newsletter, I had I had zero social media presence. I hadn't posted on Facebook since like 2018. So I wasn't a social person, but you can't escape what you're seeing. So you're seeing a lot more of us. We're recognizing that we have a lot of spending power, and we're starting to see this generation of women who might be younger than us who are just out there in the world. And they're talking and they're sharing and they're they're putting themselves in uncomfortable positions, and yet they're they're persevering. And so I think I think it's kind of a combination of these things. And then I just think that the conversation that we're having, these conversations are shifting, right? Like I would never have imagined even being 35 and talking to my girlfriends about my libido or about you know my sexual experiences or what I was feeling or why I was feeling it. So there's a shift in the content of the things that we're talking about that I think is probably contributing to a lot of this kind of culture of acceptance and appreciation for what we bring to the party.
SPEAKER_07:Um I'm a TikTok person, you know, and and I think that there's a lot of older people that come in my algorithm who uh show up and they're talking about everything. And I absolutely love it. And I stay on those, you know, and I think it's because I'm older and it really does resonate with me. But I just love that the younger people are listening to them too. And what I love about that is that at some point maybe they realize we might have some wisdom. I don't know. You know, we've we've earned it. Um, but there are a couple women on there that that's what they do. They just get up there and they they tell their wives, you know, what they're thinking for the day. And uh, I just really love that we've been given platforms.
SPEAKER_02:I think so. And I think we've been giving them, I think the conversations are changing. And what I love probably the most is that more women are taking advantage of it. More of us are standing up and kind of getting out of the shadows and going, you know what? I have something to say. I'm feeling something, I'm struggling with something. And chances are if it's happening for me to me, it's happening for a lot of other people. So what's the worst that can happen? Right. So I I recently had lunch with a group of girlfriends that I've known since I was in an elementary school. And man, that the the the tenor and the content of that lunch, I think part and parcel to what I've been writing about and how incredibly supportive they've been was totally different. Totally different. And I we all walked away feeling like like just to your point, like strand standing straighter and feeling stronger. And like, you know what? We don't owe the world, we don't owe our kids, we don't owe our partners anything, but coming to our the the collective party as who we are. And you don't need and we don't need to ask for permission for that. And we knew that at that lunch we all had each other's back. So whatever subject matter was discussed, me, when I brought up mine, it was like I knew I had six other women who were like, absolutely, you go and don't look back. And it was there's something very empowered empowering, I think, when you know you've got a collective, whether it's women that you know or women that you're engaging with or women that you're meeting who are standing alongside you, who you're not alone. Right and and that whether they're directly or indirectly, we're all kind of rooting for one another. And that's the thing that I think is super powerful.
SPEAKER_07:See, that's good too, because you know, women can be so competitive. And I think that that's great that that has shifted. But you talk about the in the heart of your message, you do talk about radical self-possession. What does that mean in plain language and how can women practice it daily?
SPEAKER_02:Yep. So here's here's what it means for me. It means you get to say no without having to write an essay.
SPEAKER_07:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:Because I'm I'm super guilty of that. You know, if if if somebody asks me to do something, whether it's associated with my kids or something else, it's like, oh man, no. And and here's the 17 reasons why I can't do it. Well, I don't know. It's just no. Or here are the things I can do. I don't owe anybody an essay. So that's one way that I've embraced this. Um I think that it's also I've realized that you know, in my career in particular, there were certain opportunities that either I didn't pursue or I wasn't invited to. And in this new phase of retirement, I'm not waiting for somebody to invite me to you to your table. If I don't like your table, and if I want to be at a table like yours, I'm gonna make my own. So I'm not waiting for somebody to invite me. So that's another way that it's um manifesting itself. I think in some ways it's also just doing um, booking a trip if you want to take a trip. Um, you know, breaking a pattern if you want to break a pattern, share something that you want to share, but just taking action and doing something, beginning. Just begin. I certainly, when I set out to do this book, I didn't have a roadmap. I've never done this before. And I am figuring it out as I go. But it started for me because I just began it. Um, I think I think the other thing that the way it shows has shown up for me is this idea that I'm not responsible for the peace of other people. And that peace doesn't come by me being soft and being calm and being easy and being small and being, you know, just. Even it just does so, and I'm not responsible for everybody else's comfort and peace and happiness. And I also think I am wholly, wholly embracing this idea of being uncomfortable and unbothered myself, but also I have to let other people sit in their own discomfort. I cannot be responsible for that. And I don't have to perform to make other people feel comfortable.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah. You know, you touched on something that I think that we uh so often do, and that's own other people's stuff. We really do. I mean, we we just pick up everybody else's baggage and we carry it around instead of lay it down and and just deal with what we have, you know. And I think that that's part of the reason why we haven't really worked on ourselves for so long, because we're working on everybody else.
SPEAKER_02:I think you're absolutely right. I think we're working on everybody else. And there's if I look back at that time as well, for me, I I had very legitimate reasons, I thought, for what I was doing. I was doing things for my kids, my partner, I was doing things for stabil stability. I was doing maybe because either directly or indirectly, some of this stuff was modeled for me. And in some cases, it was just survival, right? Like I, you know, in in some ways it was like, oh, if I just am silent about this thing, I'll power through it, I'll get through it, everything will be fine. But you know, this idea that like survival just became for me in some ways silence. And I just realized that none of those things are true. And they don't, and and and maybe they were true for me then. And I'm not gonna go back and like rehash and you know, like beat us, beat myself up with a stick about all that stuff. But what am what am I doing now? I am changing. I I don't need to follow those patterns anymore.
SPEAKER_07:And I'm not right, yeah. We don't need to be silenced, we don't need to be quiet. No, and I absolutely love that. Another thing that you point out is hormones and emotions intersect with power and confidence. Yes, I love that. Yeah, can you explain that?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so and again, I'll relate it to my own experience, but um, I think so. I was reading this article about the power of estrogen, some of these hormones, right? These female hormones for a lot of years as we're we're developing, and again, I'm not a doctor, I'm just you know, kind of a real girl trying to figure all this stuff out, right? Um, because the the changes come daily and they don't stop, I'm finding. But, you know, there's this protective layer that like some of these female hormones give us, right? Um, as we're kind of coming up in age. And they um in in in my experience, I think what they did was they also helped me to just be softer. I was uh probably a little bit more agreeable, I was a little bit softer, but I also did not have a lot of labels and names to put on the things that were happening in my body. Um, you know, if I look back in my mid-30s to late 30s, I was absolutely in full-blown perimenopause. I only know that now. I had no idea at the time. None.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:And then I get through having my last son at 40, and then things are starting to shift at 41, 42, 43, 44. And I was like, what is actually happening to me? And and I was also going through a divorce at that time. I was trying to settle and stabilize myself and my three boys. They needed me to be a steady breast. My words were off the rocker, but I didn't have a name for it. And so I think what happens was for me, looking back at that time, I am so much kindler and gentler about who I was at that period because I I now know what was happening to me. And I think, in a lot of ways, a lot of the changes that I made, I did it took a lot of confidence, but it wasn't anything that I was able to tap into because I I didn't even know I was just like, hey, these things are happening, I'm shifting all over the place, I'm not sure why, but I just have to do. And so for me, a lot of this intersection um has come through the acknowledgement that the the things that I was feeling at that time were absolutely hormonal. They were not in my head. Number one, I was not crazy, number two, and I still feel that way. And I think number three is the fact that as I've tried kind of progressed through this menopause journey, um, I have become a much more powerful force for me. I'm taking better care of myself. I'm starting to question the things that are happening to me and why. I'm not taking no for an answer when my doctor's shoulder shrugs and like, you know, yeah, you've been in menopause since 47. And yeah, it sucks that you have hot flashes again. I don't know what to tell you. Like that's unacceptable to me.
SPEAKER_05:Right. Self-advocating.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, totally, totally. And I'm taking control and I'm taking back my power to go, you know what? I'm not satisfied with that. And it's not all in my head. And this myth that I was probably given that menopause, like, I really thought once you kind of get through that magic 12 months, you tick a box and go, wow, I can turn in my card now. I'm done. That's not been my experience. And so I'm tapping into all these things and I'm feeling confident to go, no, no, no, doctor who I've seen for 25 years, I am un that answer is unacceptable to me. And I am not going to stop until I find somebody who is going to listen to what is happening to me right now. And that takes a level of power, like I'm reclaiming my power. It takes a level of the you know, acknowledgement that I am not crazy.
unknown:Right.
SPEAKER_02:These hormone things are shifting for me. And it's, and I'm I am becoming dissatisfied with answers that are not progressing me forward. So I think that that intersection, I'm not sure if I answered your question directly, but it's that intersection of, you know, we're becoming more educated, we're becoming dissatisfied with even just our the physical changes that are happening inside of our body. We're starting to now label these things because we understand them more. And we're starting to go, you know what? I am not going to sit back and just let these things happen. I'm going to get help. And that's what we're doing. Right.
SPEAKER_07:I had a vision of when you were talking about the doctor, of you know, and I've seen this happen to myself, and it's a different scenario, but it's the same thing where, like, we a woman goes to buy a car, and their experience is so different. The price that they're offered, the way that they, you know, the whole entire experience of how a salesman deals with a woman versus how a salesman deals with a man. Or if your car needs fixed, you know, they tell you all these things are wrong with it and all this stuff, and then you end up paying thousands of dollars and a man goes. And I mean, it's really true how we are treated. And uh I mean, I I still see that today.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, absolutely. So there's a couple of examples I'll give you for this. Um I I was having this conversation with a friend. I was, I was having some bladder problems. Okay. And it was, you know, I went to my doctor and she's like, well, you know, yeah, this is just what happened. She've had three kids, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, you know what? I'm unsatisfied because all I do is talk about P pads with my friends. That's a big topic of conversation. Like, well, what pad are you wearing? And is it working? Is it not? So she sent me to um a urologist who did an ultrasound. So I go back and I do the ultrasound. And we just want to make sure that there's nothing structurally wrong with the bladder. And I mentioned to the ultrasound tech, like, man, these used to be a lot more fun when I was coming in to see the baby when I was pregnant. You know, when the baby's like, Do you want me to take a picture of it? You know, I could send you home with a picture. And I'm like, no. Well, she did. And I realized one of my I we can only find one ovary in my um in my uterus. And so I go to have dinner with a girlfriend that night. And I'm like, like, did you know? And I pulled out my older sound picture, which I have right here on my desk. I said, look at my one ovary. Like, how big are our ovaries supposed to be at this age? And here we are in our mid-50s. She's like, I'm not sure. I said, are they supposed to be like walnut size or pear size? She's like, I don't know. So A, we don't know. And then I said, How come I only have one? And she's like, I don't know. So then I went on to kind of research and realized that, yeah, like sometimes what happens with your body is when you have organs that aren't used, they kind of just disappear. So I said to my girlfriend, I called her back and I said, So imagine this. What if we told men that in their mid-50s, one of their testicles was gonna shrivel up and just fall off? Yeah, you better believe we would have a national vaccine. So that's one example. Another example is so this past summer I was reading a book uh by Miranda July. It's called All Fours. It's a fictional book, a little smuddy, but it was a really good book. But in that book, she wrote she um uh created a hormone chart for men and women, estradiol and testosterone over um decades. And basically this chart shows the dramatic, not a cute little stroll down a hill, but a dramatic fall for women on estrogen and how little testosterone we have, and even the little amount we have, how how starkly it it decreases versus men who their decline is smaller. And I'm thinking to myself, I am in my mid-50s. How did I never know that? Because all the things that I was feeling from a libido standpoint, I got answered. Like that chart made sense to me. And my partner was reading the same book, would maybe like to read the same books. He had to get on a flight to London. He gets off the flight, he calls me, he said, Did you get to the chart? And I said, Well, I'm past the chart. He said, Babe, I am so sorry.
SPEAKER_04:Oh wow.
SPEAKER_02:And I I never understood that that is what was happening inside my body. And I believe that if if it were about men, every 10th grader in the US would have learned about that in health class. And it would be printed on, you know how you go to the pharmacy and you get a bag and they print like cute little reminders, you know, get your flu shot, do this. It would be printed as a warning on a pharmacy bag. Like I'm quite positive. But I think I think that that's it, it's the for me personally, it was how absolutely undereducated I was, but I didn't even know that I should be asking these questions. I just knew that stuff was happening for me. Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_07:Yes, it does. And we aren't really, we don't get a book for this. And so we aren't we we aren't told how to age as women and what's really happening with our bodies. No. So it would be really nice if physicians were more forthcoming in some of this information.
SPEAKER_02:A hundred percent, a hundred percent. And I think, you know, I think we're starting to see a lot more conversation about it. Now the challenge that I have too is man, how do I weed through? And you know, how do I decipher all this? I'm not a doctor, I didn't go to medical school, but you know, I think for me, the way I'm just kind of uh addressing all this is I'm being much more attentive to the things that are happening to me, the changes that I feel, the emotional changes, the physical changes, the reproductive changes, whatever it is. And when these things are happening, I'm asking questions. I am demanding answers from my doctor. I'm talking to my girlfriends. Like, hey, are like, is this are you sane? Am I like, am I crazy? Am I the only one? And the answer is no, you're not. So I'm just starting to key into some of those things. And I think with that ability and interest in focusing on myself, I am taking back power and I feel a lot more confident, whether it's stepping into a doctor's office and not accepting that shoulder shrug or you know, looking at, hey, yeah, my libido's changed. It does not have to feel like this.
SPEAKER_07:Right. One of the things that I've noticed about you, though, in your writing and in your speaking, when we're even talking here, one of the things that you do is you go to humor. And, you know, humor can be a real tool when we're dealing with hot flashes and um we're and we're feeling so hot and life stresses is even hotter. I mean, how how do you deal and use this as a tool?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I think, you know, it's really funny because I think in a lot of ways, I am exactly the same person, whether I'm in front of my kids. I do try to moderate my curse words in front of the kids, but I I think even now I'm like, I'm just too tired um to be that. But I'm pretty much the same person, um, you know, wherever I am. And I've just found that the only way I know how to be when I'm talking about all this stuff is just honest. And the stuff that happens to me, I love it, it's embarrassing, but it's just honest. And it is kind of funny. You know, the fact that I I I literally wrote a whole blog about P pads and the dribble because it's all I talk about right now. Right. And I feel like there's no shame in that game. I just I think, and so I think it's I'm exactly the same person that I am in front of my kids, um, in front of amazing women like you, in front of my bosses, in front of my partner, in front of my parents, whatever. Um, I think it's just being very honest and open because I kind of have felt like if I'm struggling with this stuff, I cannot be the only one. And then I think it's removing the shame. Somebody doesn't like it or somebody is offended. My answer to that is that's that's you. And and I invite you to not read what I write. Um, I invite you to not engage in the conversation then. And and that's that's a choice, right? But I think I I have removed there's no shame in it. And I think that a lot of us for a long time, me included, I felt embarrassed and shameful to kind of talk about the fact that, hey, maybe I didn't know the kinds of things that brought me pleasure in the bedroom. Maybe I didn't spend enough time really analyzing what it is that I like and what what do I need? Yeah, that's embarrassing. But you know what? If I'm struggling with this, chances are a lot of other women are as well. And why can't we just normalize it and talk about it? And it can be funny.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, it really can.
SPEAKER_02:It can be, I mean, it's and it's not to like poke fun at us, but some of the stuff that I've written about that have happened, you know, that happened to me at the time, maybe I didn't find it so funny. But looking back now, and you know, I have two um younger sisters, they're in their 30s. And in a lot of ways, I like to say that I'm like their crash test dummy. So for them, they're like, oh my God, write about everything and tell me everything, and please, please, please warn me about everything. Uh so at least I have a captive audience of some of my lovelies who are in their 30s and 40s going, this is like a this is like a a warning book. Like, and and and you know what's funny about that too, and what I love about what we're doing is I really hope we are reaching these younger women because there's so many things that we're talking about that you and Tina talk about that had I known in my 30s and 40s, I might have, I might have dismissed, who knows? I might have created even an even bigger distance between myself and like midlife or 50s, and oof, that's like old lady stuff, that's not me. But I think that there would have been shreds of things I listen to, and certainly about the changes in my hormones and my body, and if nothing else, to go wait, if I'm in my mid-30s and I'm noticing a cycle change, I need to go talk to somebody about that.
SPEAKER_07:Right. Yeah, you really bring up a lot of great questions. I think that that's one of the things that you are making the younger generations think. I hope that they pay attention to this because we didn't. So, you know, I I it's almost like I think there should be a big caution sign, you know, saying pay attention, be this is a warning.
SPEAKER_01:So this is a warning, and you'll thank us later. You really will thank us later.
SPEAKER_07:You know, we are constantly rewriting ourselves, and I think becoming better versions of ourselves as we grow. And, you know, we don't I I do have some youngers here still, but most kids, most adults my age do not have the youngers, and our careers change, we evolve, and I find that everything has been a stepping stone to where we are now in life. I can't even tell you how many identity shifts that I have had. Can you talk more about rewriting ourselves?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Um, so the identity shifts I think start with, you know, for me, you know, when you're transitioning from a college student to maybe a career person and then getting married and then becoming a mom and then you know, divorcing. And I had to kind of adapt and sort of figure out like, who who am I in the world?
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Who do I? And I don't even think I ever started with the question, who do I want to be in the world? It was almost like, who do I have to be in the world right now? And who do I have to be today? And who do I have to be for my kids, and who do I have to be for my partner, and who do I have to be for my boss? And and so those things are happening to us. And I think the subtle shift though for me was I stopped asking, who do I have to be for? And started asking, who do I want to be right now? Um, and that impacted, I think, a lot of the decisions I made, probably in relationships. It certainly impacted in my later years from a career standpoint, how I viewed my career. I stopped going, well, you know, who do I have to be to survive here? To who do I want to be? And then reclaiming that and going, Yeah, I'm gonna stay at this job. I know why I'm staying, I have a very clear intentional reason. And I'm staying because I want to be this. Cool. And it there was a level of freedom, honestly, that came when I started shifting the question that I didn't feel before. Like, if you would have asked me last year at this time, would I be an author a year later? I would have been like, You're nuts. But then I tapped into that and it's like, what, why not? So I kind of think I stopped asking, you know, who do I want to be for? And started asking, who do I want to be? And then started, I stopped asking or or or thinking this can't be me. And started going, why not? Yeah, why not? If I want to write a book, why not?
SPEAKER_07:Right. And I love that because we are better than we were a year ago or five years ago or 10 years ago. And why not?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and I think we I think a lot of it too, though, is us recognizing, like, I and I look back at that time and I I was a strong woman. I got through a lot of stuff, you know. I was, but also there were things about myself I was critical about. You know, I could look at my body in the mirror and go, man, there's 17 things I don't I don't like, or I've got a problem with my legs or whatever. But what I've realized is this is the body that got me through a lot of stuff. This is the body that gave me my three boys. This is the body that walked into jobs, and this is the body that, you know, brokered contentious work meetings. This is the body that walked me to a mediator's office when I realized that my ex-husband and I needed to make a change. I did that. And now I'm not criticizing her. I'm looking at her going, man, you know, you're pretty, you're pretty good.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah. It's it's like a tree trunk where our bodies show all the rings and everything that we've gone through, and there's like a scar here, and it's something you know, and it like shows our entire life as you know we age.
SPEAKER_02:I am embracing that. I appreciate it. And I don't, yeah, I don't have regrets. Um, that's good necessarily. I mean, I do wish I would have educated myself more on some of the hormonal stuff, but that's you know, I don't have a lot of regrets, and now it's it's not what am I doing or I can't do this. It's why not? Why can't I?
SPEAKER_07:I always say trust the process and and some of the things that we have in life that have really affected me, I know, and uh a lot of women are our failures, if that's how you want to say it, along the way, and um being able to flip it and turn our failures into blessings and end up right where we're supposed to be and use them as stepping stones. Uh, what what do you think about that?
SPEAKER_02:I could not agree more. I mean, and I I think I I spend a lot of time even reminding my kids of this, right? Um, I feel myself, I feel like I learned the most things from these either self-labeled or you know perceived failures in my life. And I don't, you know, were they painful at the time? Sure. Um, but they brought me to where I am today. They allowed me to uncover and re and reacquaint myself with a lot of the things I actually really like about myself. They allowed me to develop new muscle and new competence and new skills that maybe I didn't have before. And so do I look back at any of those and go, man, I don't. I actually don't. Um, I look back at those and I'm grateful because they made me who I am today.
SPEAKER_07:Yes. I mean, imagine if we never failed. I mean, we wouldn't even recognize when we did do well or when we did earn something.
SPEAKER_02:And wouldn't it just be so boring? It'd be like living in the Truman show or, you know, some of those. It would just be so boring. And I don't want, I don't want boring. I don't want cookie cutter. I don't want, you know, I don't want somebody telling me, oh, this is how you have to do your book, or this is how you have to do your blog, or this is how you have to show up at in this, you know, consulting engagement, or this is how you have to be to your kids right now. No, no, I get to decide.
SPEAKER_07:You know, when I started this podcast, I didn't know I was a journalist years ago. I mean, I knew how to do the journalism part, I knew how to do the mental health stuff, I knew how, but I didn't know how to do a podcast. And so, you know, it's not, it wasn't perfect or whatever. I mean, sometimes, just like you with writing a book, I mean, we just have to jump.
SPEAKER_05:Yes.
SPEAKER_07:And and, you know, if if the parachute doesn't open, maybe halfway down, you know, I mean, we made it. Um, but that's what it's all about. When when did you realize that you had a greater purpose to help people?
SPEAKER_02:Well, you know, it's a really good question. I mean, I do think if I go back, um, if I go back to, you know, just finding that folder, or you're starting that folder at 35, and I think it was born out of the maybe a little bit of a selfish need because I was struggling. And I was like, you know what? I cannot be the only one struggling here. And I need help. And how do I go about trying to find out and find that help? So I think maybe some of it was maybe born out of my own need and my own struggles for just needing comfort, needing answers, needed needing to know that I wasn't alone in all the things that I was feeling and all the things that I was experiencing. And I think I need I needed to a little bit of affirmation and and validation for myself that I wasn't crazy, that all of these things that I was feeling and experiencing were normal, and that I wasn't alone. And I think that that same set of principles applied when I found the folder. And I started thinking about all the subjects that were feeling overwhelming to me, or changing, or shifting, or that were bubbling up to the surface in a really exciting way, or that I was afraid of. And I was like, you know, I cannot be the only one here. And I want more people talking to me. I want, apparently, I wanted more help. I wanted more help from other people. I wanted to hear what other women were going through. I wanted to hear what other experts had to say about this stuff because I wanted to help me. So maybe it was a little bit of that. I kind of needed to help myself a little bit. And I recognized in the process of me helping me, I could maybe help other people. Right. Um, so I think it's that kind of, you know, I I fly a lot. Um, my partner uh lives in Australia, so we have a long distance um relationship.
SPEAKER_05:Oh, that's so cool.
SPEAKER_02:It's so my um, but I fly a lot, and you know the announcement that the flight attendants will make about the oxygen mass dropping. Like if it drops, what are you supposed to do?
SPEAKER_07:You have to take care of yourself first.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah. And I think I think I probably subconsciously always felt like that was that was a cute idea. Like, oh, but when you're a mom and you're all these other things, like I didn't that that's not real. People don't do that. And now I'm realizing, yeah, they do. You have to.
SPEAKER_07:Right. Yeah, you just kind of touched on something else with um boundaries and things that are really important. What boundaries would you say are non-negotiables when we're reinventing ourselves? Or how do we stop apologizing for honoring them?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I think the one, I think, I think a big one is you sort of have to write a promise to yourself that whatever it is that you want to do, right? Whatever it is, and and I kind of did this when I started writing the book. I I wrote down that um kind of a paragraph, and basically that paragraph said things like, this is gonna feel very overwhelming. You don't have a playbook here, you don't know what steps you're gonna have to take, but this is important. You started this, you had this idea 20 years ago, you found it now, you're just going to do it. And it also was a way to remind myself that I am very resourceful and I know this about myself. If I don't know something, I know, I trust myself enough to know I will figure it out. That has been, I've I've done that in most aspects of my life. I'll feel afraid, I won't have a playbook, I won't have a guidebook, but I know enough about me to go, you will figure it out. And and I wrote that down. You won't know a lot of things to do, you won't know the next five things. And I like a good plan. I like a good plan. And man, you are jumping into the deep end with some of this stuff, and I don't know what's coming at me next, but I know me. And I know that I'm resourceful, and I know that I will figure it out. And so I had to write that down and just and and every once in a while I open the red folder and I look at that paragraph and I go, okay, it feels overwhelming today, but I will figure it out. I will figure it out.
SPEAKER_07:I think that you just defined most women, yeah, and and that we are so resilient, yeah. And I think that family basically is because of women. And you think, and we it doesn't matter what problem hits our family or our kids or us, we don't know the next step in front of us. Sometimes we can't even see, let alone five steps ahead of us, but maybe the one right in front of us. But we always figure it out.
SPEAKER_02:We just do, we just do, and I think and I can tell you every woman that I know, every woman that I've met through this process, I can tell you that they have that same trait. Everyone and it's it's like you have to tap into it, you have to you have to remind yourself of it, and you have to trust yourself. That's right, that you've done it before and you can keep doing it. That's what I think. Um and I think for me too, it was changing the question. It was I'm not starting anything new with you know, what about this? And oh gosh, it can't be this, and you know, I don't know these things, and what if I what if this and what if that? It was the question became why not? Why can't I? Why can't I write a book?
SPEAKER_07:Right, right.
SPEAKER_02:Why can't I start a substack?
SPEAKER_07:When you when you were talking about when we were talking about women and men, I uh it made me think about how that's I can see God saying, you know, oh I made Adam, oh shoot. I really I really I really have to have somebody help navigate the world and this guy and or help or else it's not going anywhere. So I'm gonna have to send a woman. I just have to, in order for a family to be able to make it.
SPEAKER_02:So true. You could almost just imagine, like, oops, there could be a fatal flaw on my plan. I better fix this.
SPEAKER_07:Yes. So one of the things that I love about your uh community is that you have you're building a community through RGG55 or 55. Yeah, and I think that that's so important. How do you think midlife friendships are? I mean, I'm I they are so different. My older friends are still, for one thing, they're working into their 60s and 70s now. It's it's not the way it used to be. And I'm also because my youngers have I'm friends with some of the younger generations, but in this stage of my life, I like the real, more authentic relationships. That's just where I am. I don't want to do fake. Don't even bother me with the fake because I'm not going there. I just want, I want real.
SPEAKER_02:You've hit it. And I did a um a blog article on midlife friendships, and I think you hit it. It's this isn't a volume play. This isn't a quantity play, it's a quality play. And I've, you know, who are the women or the men? Like, who are the friends that are adding stuff? Something to my life where I feel like I cannot talk to them for two or three months and then we reconnect and it's like no time has passed. Or the friends who know that I'm doing something big or I'm I'm you know staring down the face of a big problem and who will drop me a text and go, Hey, I'm just thinking about you today. It's it's it's not fake, it's not performative, it's not competitive, it's just real. And it's it's the friends who get honest with me about what's going on for them. It's the friends that I trust that I can be honest with. And it's it's removing the shame and the the this need to one up each other or this need to appear perfect. Like I am not. And those are the friendships that I keep gravitating toward. And it's some of them are newer friends that I've met through work or through friends of my kids or um, you know, friends of friends, even. It's the realness, the authentic relationships. It's the people that I don't need to perform for or I'm not competing with. It's the people that I can get honest with and get honest with me, and the people that want to see me succeed and be successful and build me up and remind me that I can do anything I put my mind to on the days where I feel shaky.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, I I can pick up on it right away. I mean, if somebody's fake, it's like, okay, hi, bye. Nice to know you, you know, and move on.
SPEAKER_02:It's our radar, and I think part of that too is this again, kind of trusting in ourselves. Like our radar is really good. And we've got to trust it. And when the when the spidey senses are going, this isn't feeling right, you gotta go with that. And then feeling confident that I can trust my intuition. Nine times out of ten, honestly, when I get a gut feeling, it I usually find myself in trouble when I don't trust it.
SPEAKER_07:Exactly. Yes, if I second guessed, and it and so I've learned to just, and I'm always, and it's really funny. I don't really mean to brag, but I'm normally right.
SPEAKER_00:You should well, and brag. And it's okay, you've earned the right because your track record proves it.
SPEAKER_07:Like, right, yeah, yeah. I I think it is maybe that wisdom. I'm not really sure, but we I think have earned the right to be able to go with our gut.
SPEAKER_02:100%. We more than earned the right, like we've lived through the the storms, we've persevered through the issues, we've built and have always been resilient. Like that, those are those are our rights. That that more than anything, um, we need to lean on that.
SPEAKER_07:When I was younger, I looked at my aunt Hazel, who I thought was always old, she always looked old. Um, but she lived a lot longer than I I you know, I always thought she was on death's door, I guess, but she really wasn't. Um, but that's how we look at older people when we're younger. And but what I loved the most, and I can specifically remember this, is that no matter where I went with her, I was a little embarrassed sometimes, but she was always herself. Always. She never apologized, she was just really just who she was. And I said to myself, when I got a little older and I really looked up to that, I was like, oh my gosh, that's what I want to be when I'm older. I want to be just like my Aunt Hazel. I don't want to make apologies for who I am, I just want to be.
SPEAKER_02:You know, I I have a similar story. It um, and for me, it was my Aunt Joe. She was my great-great aunt, believe it or not. So she was alive when I was a teenager, and I used to spend a lot of time one-on-one time with her because she actually just had a connection. And she would take me to amusement parks, she would bring me to her house, we'd do sleepovers. And what I loved about her was not only was she not apologetic, but she was not afraid to ask for what she wanted. And if she wanted something, she was gonna go out and get it. And she didn't sacrifice, she didn't try to placate other people, she wanted the things that she wanted and she she made them happen for herself. And I very prim and proper, always with the hair done, always just looked immaculate with the purse and the outfit, and the car was clean, the house was clean, always perfect. Always, but she never um she never wavered on what it is she wanted. Yes, and I love that about my aunt Joe. I'm glad we share that. I love that.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, she was my actually my great aunt too. My dad was older, she he was an older generation when I was adopted by him. So his sister, who was actually 20 years older than her, him, even, you know. I mean, it so she was much older, but um, she really taught me a lot, and that's why. This is why people need to pay attention to our generation because we really can pass down these things.
SPEAKER_02:We can pass them down from things that we've learned. They're they're like lived experiences. Like, honestly, pay attention to us. We we have lived it, and if we didn't live it, we know somebody who who've lived who has, and also I think that we pay we pay great attention. We are stewards of this stuff, and we are attentive, we are um, we've lived it, we have experiences, and now we are shaping those into helpful guides, helpful pitfalls to avoid, empowering messages that man, if I were in my 30s and 40s right now, I'd be soaking this up all the time, all the time.
SPEAKER_07:I think though, the younger generation, and I think that I was guilty of this too. You know, I mean, we think we know it all. So it's it's kind of getting past that to be able to listen.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I think it's that, or for me, a lot of it was that's never gonna happen to me. Yeah, that's never gonna happen to me. I don't have to worry about that. It's like, well, I just wish I would have. I I really think, and I say this to my sisters all the time, who are super gracious, right? My younger sisters in their 30s. I'm like the crash test dummy, but they're always super appreciative, like, oh my gosh, Ang, thank you. Thank you for telling us all this stuff. Thank you for being so open and real. And, you know, like, yeah, are they gonna do anything different with the information? But at least they're aware. Um, and at least like somewhere in the back of their brains, like maybe it's not today, but maybe in five or 10 years when their cycles are changing or the hot flashes begin, they'll go, wait a second, she talked to me about this. I remember this. Like, I gotta go do something about this.
SPEAKER_07:With our age, one of the things that happens is that uh, you know, we've been hit with curveball after curveball. We've just had life. We have had life. So, what do you think um people can take with them from us the most? I mean, when we are the most down and out, unable to really even feel like that we can get up, when we're at our lowest moments, what advice would you give?
SPEAKER_02:I think the advice I'd give is like, you know, acknowledge where you're at and don't dismiss your feelings, don't try to justify your feelings, but you know, feel the things you need to feel and you know begin. Take a step. Maybe that first step is calling a friend and going, hey, I don't I don't know what's happening, but something's happening for me. Or, you know, reach out for help, pick up a book, um, listen to a podcast, um, just begin. And but I think the first thing is acknowledging how you feel, acknowledging where you're sitting and being like don't try to minimize that, don't try to rationalize it. Just embrace where you're at, embrace how you're feeling and begin. Take a small step, ask for help, reach out to a friend, send a text, listen to a podcast, pick up a book, just begin.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, keep moving, keep moving.
SPEAKER_02:And I think it'll it a lot of this stuff, you know, depending on the thing that we're facing, some of these things can feel so overwhelming, they can feel so destabilizing, they can feel crushing. Um, but I think the one thing to remember is chances are you've been through something like that, worse, or that made you feel the way you're feeling. And how did you get through it? Because you you probably did.
SPEAKER_07:Right. You made it through those, you'll make it through this.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. And and it and there's no shame in asking for help. There's no shame in reaching out going, I am struggling today. Or can you can you can you throw a little extra positive juju my way today? Because here's this thing that I'm facing. Um, yeah. And I I think, and then, and then I think you just begin.
SPEAKER_07:I love that you've created a movement basically, and you actually have an upcoming book that you've been talking about. I would like to hear more about it and interviewing 100 plus women. I mean, I just can't even imagine the amount of wisdom that you've been hearing.
SPEAKER_02:It is incredible. So, yeah, I mean, you know, the way I kind of think about the difference between, you know, the Substack, Real Um Real Girls Guide to Over 55 is our community. It's the place where we can just dive in, real time, chat, share. And the book is really the companion. And it is this um, you know, reframing of all the things that are happening us through my story, through the stories of other women, through the stories of uh experts to remind us that we're not alone. And it's not gonna give you the prescription to deal with everything perfectly, but it's certainly gonna open up your eyes to A, you're not alone, B, other women, other experts can help you and C, there is a path forward. You can move through these things and be better for them. And so um the interviewing, um, it was about 120 women and about 25 experts. Um, and it was the most humbling experience. And again, you know, I kind of sat down on this path and I had an idea of the structure for the book that I wanted, and I wanted it to be some of my stories, but more importantly, more importantly, I wanted it to be the stories of other women and experts who have a perspective that maybe I didn't know or that could help me navigate what was happening to me. Might not solve my problem, but man, it could give me something that I didn't know before I started. And um, you know, I was, I kind of went down the path and I was like, well, you know, it would be great. Like I have some friends I can talk to for sure. I can talk to my mom, but the absolute outpouring of women who were so brave and so open and so giving and gracious with their stories and the experts who gave their time and their wisdom and their advice, like I I was completely humbled. And again, I don't I don't I've never done this before. So I was floored and so incredibly grateful. And I mean, I took something, and I can honestly say this I took something away from every single person who shared something for me for this book. And and the way I look at it, the book is not my book. The book is our book, the community RGG55 is not mine, it's ours. It's it belongs to all of us who are just in this messy middle, um, getting through these transitions, dealing with all the curveballs that man, they just keep coming. Um, and it's not mine, it's ours. And I I just and it will always be that way for me.
SPEAKER_07:I love it because I always say that everybody has a story. And I always wanted to just sit at a rest stop and interview people on their travel and their story because everybody's going somewhere and everybody has a story to tell. So I'm love I love that you're telling yours and 120 other women's stories. I mean, oh my gosh, the amount of wisdom that you took away from that, I can't wait to read it, honestly. I think that that's fantastic.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you so much. I'm super excited, and um, the book will be coming out in December. We're gonna do a little cover reveal coming up here soon, and that's been a fun process. And yeah, and RGG55 continues on. I I write about three, three posts a week. Um, some of them are funny and we do polls, we do little reframes of the month. Some of them are hard and a little bit more serious. Uh, you know, there's still a few blogs that I go back to um that really kind of create a lot of emotion in me. Um, but it's very real and it's very raw and it's just human.
SPEAKER_07:What do you think the future of midlife revolution is and how this can spark the future for other generations?
SPEAKER_02:I I mean, I think that I think we are gonna see a complete and utter shift in things like women's healthcare, um in the kinds of conversations that women are having, and quite honestly, the the conversations that men are picking up on and becoming participants in. Um and I think that this shift is gonna continue. You know, if I if I go back to sort of where we started, you can't ignore the numbers, right? Um, you can't ignore the fact that women over 50 represent such a huge part of the female population. You can't ignore the spending power that women have and will continue to have. And I think we're starting to see shifts, right? We as women and men are educating ourselves. We are participating in these conversations and we are demanding the kind of care that we feel like we deserve. And if we're not getting it, we're not gonna be dismissed. We're not, we're not gonna be gaslit. If I'm not getting the support I need, I don't have to struggle. I don't have to sit back and you know start crocheting because I'm retired. I don't have to stop wearing trucker hats. I wrote a blog about trucker hats because I loved a good trucker hat. And somebody that I know, I wore one, and she said, I can't believe you still wear those. I said, What do you mean? She's like, Well, those are for teenagers. You need a full brim situation. I'm like, the heck I do. What? Try again. Try that again. And so now I make it a point. Every time I see her, I wear a trucker hat. Um, so I think we're starting to see this, you know, we're not we're not standing behind the shadows and you know, in cardigans and house dresses and slippers, and you can't ignore it. Like even my kids, now granted, I talk a lot about stuff here, but even my boys, you know, they're getting exposed to words like menopause, libido, um, you know, perimenopause, hot flashes, uh, you know, they've they've watched me, they've watched me grind hard at a career for 30 years. They've seen me pick up a folder for something that I had the idea to do 20 years ago. They've seen me take a risk and just do the thing. They're seeing all that. And that's I I think that these kinds of things are gonna carry us forward and they're gonna carry our the generation after us forward because our kids, those of us who are around people who are younger, they are seeing the motion, they are hearing the words, they're feeling the vibration changing, the frequency changing. And you can't tell but not absorb that.
SPEAKER_07:Right. I bet your kids um really enjoy those conversations.
SPEAKER_02:They do. You can you can imagine. Sometimes uh, you know, I'll I'll just randomly walk through the house and drop a word like tampon, and you know, just because I like to hear a reaction, or I don't care.
SPEAKER_07:Hey, you know what? They're going to be so informed for their partners later.
SPEAKER_02:That's exactly right.
SPEAKER_07:That's great. I think that's awesome.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I do always tell my kids, you know, I have a lot of mantras. My boys call them mantras, but um, one of them is, you know, if you're gonna take a risk in life, always bet on yourself. And for me, I can't, and the thing that I try to remember with my kids in particular, I can't just tell them the thing. I have to show them the thing. You know, you want to have these conversations with your partners and you want to be really explicit and really clear, and you know, consent is everything, and you want to not, you know, all these things. I can't just tell them that. I have to show them. So I have to be comfortable in these things. And man, for better or for worse, these boys are getting an education.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, it's the same thing with me and my kids. I mean, I'm just not gonna tell them to go out and work hard. And I mean, I'm gonna grind, I'm gonna show you how to do it.
SPEAKER_02:So I'm gonna show you how to, yeah, and you're gonna trust that I did it when I was in my 20s, you're gonna trust I did it when I was in my 30s, you saw that I did it in my 40s, and now you're gonna see me keep going. And it's not gonna stop until I decide it stops.
SPEAKER_07:I have one last question. If you could host a dream round table with three women who inspire you, alive or not, who would they be? And what would you want to know?
SPEAKER_02:Okay, well, first I would um invite Jamie Lee Curtis because that woman is the most incredible example of um just embracing life with zero apologies, full throttle, arms wide open, and the energy that says, I don't give an F about anything. Um, and she's a great mother, she's a great human, she cares about humanity and she's got all these causes, and she just walks into a room and owns it. So that would be one. Um, I think the other one would be my grandma Gemma, if I'm honest with you, because while I had her in my life until I was in my 30s, um and actually until I was 40, she died just before I uh like four days before I had my last son. Um I did not appreciate her enough. I don't think I asked her the right questions. And I wish I wish I would have had more conversations with her about things that were very specific. Um, so I I think that that would be one. Um, and then the third one, I'm completely right now enamored with um Bozama St. John. She is the former CMO of places like Apple, uh Beats by Dre. She worked at Netflix, PepsiCo. And she is, I mean, the energy that she brings to not only her and and the um the pride that she brings to the career that she built, the personal adversities that she lived through, the raising of her daughter, and the work that she's doing now. Um, I think it's pretty badass if I say so. Um, and I think she would be an amazing person to just sit and talk to. So it'd be Jamie Lee Curtis, um, my grandma Gemma, and uh Bozama St. John. I think it'd be a pretty impactful um uh sit-down.
SPEAKER_07:Wouldn't that be awesome to be able to? Oh gosh.
SPEAKER_02:So good. Like I have all the questions, and I just it's almost like you want to absorb that energy and those vibes just by osmosis. Like just sit here and just like give me all your juju. Just I want to take it all and I've got all these questions for you too.
SPEAKER_07:I would love to sit across from people that I really admire and just soak in everything.
SPEAKER_02:Everything, just a lot of the energy that I just want to absorb and I want to carry forward for my boys, for my kids, um, for my sisters, um, for all my friends like you and all the people that I've met. Um, I just want to carry that energy forward for all of us.
SPEAKER_07:How can people get a hold of you and visit your website?
SPEAKER_02:Yes. Well, um, come to RealGirlsguide55.com, which is on Substack. Um, it's where I do all my writing. Um, I'm on Instagram, so real Real Girls Guide55. Um, that's a fun place um to find me. Um, I have a website called RealGirlsguide.com. And um I'll be sharing more about the book as we get closer to launching that on my socials. And the other exciting thing that we've got running now until the end of October is a giveaway for Menopause Awareness Month. Um so if you subscribe to the Substack and um follow me on the socials and share and repost and tag, you'll be entered in for a chance to win one of three glow up kits with some of my very favorite favorite items. There's no sponsorship, nobody's paid me to do it, but it's just I love um sharing things that work for me.
SPEAKER_07:That's so awesome. And this has been amazing. I just want to thank you so much for being on. Well, Angela, thank you so very much for being here today. This has been so much fun. I'm going to read your Substack and your book that's coming out. Thank you for reminding us that midlife is not a negative, but a revolution. It's the moment that we stop asking for permission and start taking up space. This is a different way to see aging. We are not like our parents' generations. We are just not. I mean, women are growing and evolving into powerful change makers with purpose. This is much greater than we ever imagined. For our listeners, if you are a midlife power woman, or if you know one, please check out Angela's Substack, RG55, in her community Real Girls Guide. You will find powerful women, real stories, and women who are rewriting their script on what it means to thrive after 40. Subscribe to Real Talk with Tina and and by the way, share this episode with someone who needs to be a part of this community. We are not alone. We are not invisible. We are just getting started. Midlife isn't the end of the story. It's the chapter where the heroine finally writes her own plot. Remember, there is always purpose in the pain and hope in the journey. Thank you for joining Real Talk with Tina and Anne, and we will see you next time.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you for having me.
